Curse

ZING · Jul 01, 2005, 07:44 PM // 19:44

Recently I've been tinkering with an all warrior group in the Tombs, and I've had limited but promising success. At this point I'm mainly working on which builds to bring along, and which tactics to employ.

This is definitely an advanced group. You can't bring along stupid n00bs on this one, as I've learned from first hand knowledge that your all War group won't last very long if you do.

Here's how I've been spec'ing the team so far, and the thought behind it:
The idea of an all Warrior group is mainly forcing a 1v1 battle between both groups.
No one in there right mind is going to spec to go up against an all War group (element of major surprise).

I bring along 4 W/Mo’s. Two of the secondary class monks are actually nothing more then ‘hidden monks.’ Their purpose is to be healers, and they’ll be the ones responsible early on for ‘attacking’ the opposing group's monks. An all Warrior group can get away with not having an actual healer, since they obviously take less damage.

Bring 2 W/N who have Plague Signet equipped. They’re the ones who will be going 1v1 with the casters so fond of passing on those hexes, and conditions that make a War so useless. They’ll simply go in, accept the conditions intentionally, and pass them on to whatever opposing player is about to be attacked by one of the more offensive Wars.

Bring 2 W/R with Nature’s Renewal and Antidote signet and Troll Urgent. Half their arsenal is intended to make them self sufficient.

Still tinkering with the other 2 W/Mo’s at the moment. Right now they’re spec’ed for pure offence.

Tactics:
Never EVER initiate combat. Move to an open area and let other team move into position to get you. When other team is out in the open, you can make a move which gives all War’s access to their respective targets.

2 W/N always move in first because they’re going to be hit with every negative condition in the book.

Send in 2 W/R next. As they’re arriving at their targets the 2 W/N should be passing on negative conditions to opponents of W/R.

Offensive W/Mo’s move in next to target anyone left who isn’t a monk.

Healing W/Mo’s move in last to take up attacking positions on any healing/protection monks, while also healing their own group.

If any particular opponent ever runs off, NEVER follow. Just simply turn to whichever target is weakest and help bring it down with any offense in your skill bar. Wait for your target to come back into battle range before returning to it.

Like I said, I’ve had limited but promising results with it, mainly because it takes a really good group to pull it off.

When things go well, you obliterate the opposing party super fast. If they go so-so, it’s a toss-up as to who wins, and if at any point anyone in your party gets retarded your group pretty much bites the dust fast.

Feel free to test it out yourself. I’d love to get feedback on how best to build the group.

scott silverblade · Jul 01, 2005, 08:03 PM // 20:03

you would face a number of problems with this build. A very basic ranger build would dominate all your warriors. First off warriors armor is only good against physical. It only has 80-85 armor vs elemental which quite honestly is very average. Secondly, after a good 2-3 heals each w/mo would be flat out out of energy. Your team is easily drainable since each guy would have at most like 40 energy. To be honest, if my guild ranger group 1v1'd ur all warrior group I dont think you would get a single kill. And for surprise, we'd be laughing. So long as your opposing team doesnt only have physical damage they are going to be much better off than you think. All monks works because you can mix healing and damage from within the profession. All warriors does not have that luxery. Condider this, a very basic warrior with a firey dragon sword would be slamming you for considerable damage since it is an elemental weapon. Your build is just full of holes.

Perishiko ReLLiK · Jul 01, 2005, 08:05 PM // 20:05

Already been tinkered with... Secondary necro's, nice... secondary rangers, nice...

Rangers:: Winnowing(if wanted/have space), predatory season (Extra survivability for the whole group (Helps more with a team built purely on physical dmg and quick attacks (Tigers fury with predatory goes well, as both are beast mastery) and flury, and lowers healing capabilities by 20%), it's a good idea to use axe warriors, kicking up a ton of deep wounds (that's now 40% healing take down from enemies...)

Necros:: Order of the vampire is a favorite... it adds pure dmg, and life stealing, and it's nice to have Order of pain as well (but definately not needed) And each one should have plague touch, or... the skills you're wanting to use, but i think order of vamp is a nice elite skill, needed... so plague touch helps take out some of that.

One of the monk secondary warriors should have Martyr (Very needed for blind/poison/ect), and purge conditions (obvious second skill with martyr) This martyr warrior should also have smite hex and remove hex (as hex's really hurt a team like this)

Yukito Kunisaki · Jul 01, 2005, 08:06 PM // 20:06

that sounds hella fun...

enemy team is looking for a soft target, wait, there ISN'T ONE!

So the try to take out the right priority target, avoiding W/Mos...

Then WHAMMO, warriors can do energy denial/disruption with any weapon in the book... Hmm... tough call..

Ancalagon06 · Jul 02, 2005, 01:27 AM // 01:27

This many Warriors, if they keep an eye on their adrenal skills, and with TS, they could tear apart an opponent in seconds. Two warriors with hammer, each with backbreaker, could put an opponent down for a long time, and blind him, and then a warrior with a sword could finish him off with final thrust, and if that doesn't kill him, certainly the axe warriors with eviscerate and executioner's strike could slice him to ribbons.

I like to call this the "spread out, charge up, and then gang-rape" strategy. Each warrior goes and finds a target, and starts whailing on them. At the precise moment the leader calls a target, everyone splits off from their punching bag and descends upon the poor fool who's about to be destroyed. They should have enough adrenal charge up to easily move onto another toon and tear him apart too. Hell, two death squads of 4 warriors each would destroy any team quickly. 1 Hammer Warrior, 2 Axe Warriors, and a Sword Warrior in each.

It's cruel, it's playful, I like it.

Phades · Jul 02, 2005, 04:14 AM // 04:14

Ward heavy builds would hurt the warrior team, as would 2-3 fire or air mages. You couldnt really stop them all before you got into melee and they would have a decent shot and vaporizing someone before they even got into melee. IW mesmer and smiting monks would be most unfriendly as well. Im sure that only 2 necros or rangers would have ample time to spread the love to all the warrirors as well.

The premis of the attack is fairly sound, but there are alot of ways it could fail even with a good group of guys practicing it. This kind of idea would seem more likely to suceede in a 4v4 arena than a tombs setting to be honest. Although it would probably make an awesome relic running group.

Lol i can see it now, 2 guys, both with charge and balanced stance while having a couple guys with hex/condition removal to cover em. With alot of warriors like that in a specific situation, you could probably get away with eliete choices like that.

Minwanabi · Jul 02, 2005, 05:02 AM // 05:02

Try something like this, if you're intent on playing a warrior heavy build: 7 warriors, and make sure at least two have rigor mortis, so you can completely nullify guardian, aegis, wards, and any defensive stances, and have the 8th be a necro with double orders, adding 34 damage to every attack each warrior makes. Their normal swings would spikes in of themselves, just make sure you have a war running life bond/protective bond on the necro.

ComMan · Jul 02, 2005, 05:16 AM // 05:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Minwanabi

Try something like this, if you're intent on playing a warrior heavy build: 7 warriors, and make sure at least two have rigor mortis, so you can completely nullify guardian, aegis, wards, and any defensive stances, and have the 8th be a necro with double orders, adding 34 damage to every attack each warrior makes. Their normal swings would spikes in of themselves, just make sure you have a war running life bond/protective bond on the necro.

You are a force of pure evil, just so you know. I wonder if that would work with a Ranger group...especially if everyone ran Tiger's Fury.

Meimei · Jul 02, 2005, 06:54 AM // 06:54

4x Mesmer, good game 4x warrior

Mantra of Persistence - Stance
For 30..78 seconds, any Illusion Magic Hex you cast lasts 20..84% longer

Imagined Burden - Hex Spell
For 8-18 seconds, target foe moves 50% slower than normal.

Crippling Anguish {Elite} - Hex Spell
For 8-18 seconds, target moves 50% slower and suffers health degeneration of 1-3

Conjure Phantasm - Hex Spell
For 2-12 seconds, target foe experiences health degeneration of 5.

this allow you to hex cripples for 32 secs and conjure phantsm for 22 secs, and some drain enchancement and drain energy.

Kellogs · Jul 02, 2005, 07:09 AM // 07:09

yeah sure that build would own the warrior but how hard would it be to find 8 illusion mesmers in the tombs compared to finding 8 warriors...

Cs Coldize · Jul 02, 2005, 07:31 AM // 07:31

get your guild-mates to do it

ZING · Jul 02, 2005, 08:51 AM // 08:51

The group definately isn't perfect. If you knew it was coming you could easily spec to wipe it out -- BUT: who is really going to spec a group to go up against 8 warriors?

4 of the 8 warriors in the group are pretty much immune to anything you're going to throw at them. The 2 W/R can cleanse themselves with Natures Renewal and Antidote Signet, while the 2 W/N can one up them by passing on all the negative conditions. You time the use of Plague Signet right, and you'll have tanks showing up at the doorstep of a completely helpless soft target.

When things go well I've seen Plague Signet used, and the complete wiping out of a soft target before a monk even get's a chance to cast a heal.

It's not like this build is ever being used, or is even recognized at the moment. What always happens, and so far, it's always happened, is that the two W/N running in first are pretty much laughed at as every condition known to man is applied to them. Both of them then pass on the fun to a soft target and the remaining War's charge in and obsolutely slaughter the now helpless fools that were Signet'ed.

Working with this kind of group I've only seen one undeniable truth so far: which ever group kills first wins. End of story. It doesn't even matter that you can rez the dead party member. You tip the balance of power in either direction and it's over.

It doesn't take rocket science to figure that out either. You give two Warriors a chance to beat on one target for a while and that's a problem, while forcing a Warrior group to get into major healing and rezzing is going to be a problem as well.

Which is why I guess it's such an advanced group to play with.

Ishamael Sedai · Jul 02, 2005, 11:18 AM // 11:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by ComMan

You are a force of pure evil, just so you know. I wonder if that would work with a Ranger group...especially if everyone ran Tiger's Fury.

I played a physical based dmg team in the tombs one night. They weren't all warriors, but had a necro doing similar to what the guy above you stated and rangers had spirits increasing everyone's hp and increasing physical dmg. It hurt sniping and dragged out of the fight. In the longer fight the warriors clearly had the advantage on us plus they were doing quite a large amount of dmg themselves.

Yukito Kunisaki · Jul 02, 2005, 11:36 PM // 23:36

An all warrior team can specc to kill any other team specced against it so finding weaknesses in ANY team build is a shot at stupidity...

Yeah, u'll just "know" what the enemy is going to use, sure...

Rangers: Shield's Up!! gg, ur dmg is reduced to nothing and 30% is snuffed
Mesmers: Remove Hex, Savage/disrupting,backbreaker... bah...
Necros: Mend/Remove Hex

erm... u get the idea... Warriors have 2ndary classes which can be used to make them harder to snuff... low energy? There are warrior energy management skills too ya know. Victory is Mine! Warrior's Endurance. Each has a weakness but so does every skill.

But I would most certainly like to believe an all warrior build would be FEAR itself. [have all of them running Watch Yourself and Fear Me and laugh ^_^]

Eonwe · Jul 03, 2005, 01:23 AM // 01:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Meimei

4x Mesmer, good game 4x warrior

Mantra of Persistence - Stance
For 30..78 seconds, any Illusion Magic Hex you cast lasts 20..84% longer

Imagined Burden - Hex Spell
For 8-18 seconds, target foe moves 50% slower than normal.

Crippling Anguish {Elite} - Hex Spell
For 8-18 seconds, target moves 50% slower and suffers health degeneration of 1-3

Conjure Phantasm - Hex Spell
For 2-12 seconds, target foe experiences health degeneration of 5.

this allow you to hex cripples for 32 secs and conjure phantsm for 22 secs, and some drain enchancement and drain energy.

Crippling Anguish is terrible, lol.

Also, an all warrior build would never work in tombs.

Aernok · Jul 03, 2005, 01:28 AM // 01:28

Throw in a Greater Conflag to render life bond worthless (though they'll probably give up on life bond when nature's renewal goes down).

A healing seed or mark of protection could ruin you if you're not quick to jump to another target or can't get the target down in 6 seconds (the time it takes to cast a healing seed with nature's renewal up).

Ollj · Jul 03, 2005, 04:58 AM // 04:58

muhahahaha is this thread a late aprils fool?
Can impossibly be taken seriously.

Warriors as hidden healers? W T F?
The funniest thing in guild wars are Warriors that think they can heal, and they are all wrong WRONG WRONG!

I bet it only takes one soloing necro to kill a group of 8 warriors.
They dont care for physical armor!

I strictly believe that more than 2 of the same class is too much.
For Warriormonks i strictly believe that even one is too much ;D !

Morganas · Jul 03, 2005, 07:04 AM // 07:04

Ollj, of course the w/mo's can't serve as true healers, but they don't have to. They just have to use the healing skills they have in the first push to protect the opponent's first target from spiking, just long enough for your team to close to melee range and get the first kill, which wouldn't take long at all in a team of warriors. After that, just kill them faster than they kill you.

timmo567 · Jul 03, 2005, 07:25 AM // 07:25

Thing is by the time 1 warrior reaches his target, he's already dead. When a target starts taking damage, healing seed, healing hands, mark of protection ect. Some very common skills monks carry. Will work against some builds though.. say.... one that has no monk at all

Morganas · Jul 03, 2005, 05:43 PM // 17:43

That's why you have w/necs and w/mes who can remove enchants.